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so really it's all about the fiscal cliff, guys. i wish i had something a little more light and fun for you on a monday morning. >> nothing like going through friday's numbers, down to 7.7%. a lot of chatter over the weekend that was only because people were getting out of the workforce in record numbers, et cetera, et cetera. what's your take? what's wall street's take on the numbers on friday? >> reporter: it's like this. it's like i reported on friday. it's better than expected. what we did in our "street signs" was why are the expectations so low? i went through the numbers, back to 2002, ten years ago. 57 months in the past ten years, we have gained more than 200,000 jobs, but now 146,000 is considered good because the expectations are low. so, yes, the number was better than expected but i think as a nation many people we talked to say up to the point where we could add 200,000, 250,000 jobs a month because that will help reduce the deficit. growth is actually the best solution to reducing the deficit. it's not tax hikes. it's
so really it's all about the fiscal cliff, guys. i wish i had something a little more light and fun for you on a monday morning. >> nothing like going through friday's numbers, down to 7.7%. a lot of chatter over the weekend that was only because people were getting out of the workforce in record numbers, et cetera, et cetera. what's your take? what's wall street's take on the numbers on friday? >> reporter: it's like this. it's like i reported on friday. it's better than expected....
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that's not what the american people thought the fiscal cliff was about. they thought it was about trying to have something to force us, force our congress and our president to do something about the deficit and debt situation. everything they're talking about will make it worse. >> what's the answer? will we have the deal? >> the real answer is to have comprehensive. look at this. i as a republican, i would take raising the rates on the two top brackets if, in return, we had tax reform laid out over a period of months, if we had entitlement reform. we have to control defense spending. we have to control other no non- -- other discretionary non-defense spending. i think if you have the whole package, i would hold my nose despite the fact raising those two tax brackets is bad economics, bad for jobs, will hurt the economy, i would hold my nose to get the other done. what i wouldn't do is vote for that and do nothing else. >> agree completely. what i've been saying here. steve rattner. >> i agree completely. to get a big deal we all have to hold our nose a l
that's not what the american people thought the fiscal cliff was about. they thought it was about trying to have something to force us, force our congress and our president to do something about the deficit and debt situation. everything they're talking about will make it worse. >> what's the answer? will we have the deal? >> the real answer is to have comprehensive. look at this. i as a republican, i would take raising the rates on the two top brackets if, in return, we had tax...
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Dec 7, 2012
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cliff talks is the debt ceiling, with the government on pace to reach its borrowing limit early next year. the white house stated its position on the 14th amendment, which some theory rise is a way for the president to raise the debt limit independently, should republicans attempt to use it as a negotiating tool. >> i can say that this administration does not believe that the 14th amendment gives the president the power to ignore the debt ceiling, period. >> the fiscal cliff talks reached a new low yesterday when, somehow, the new york jets got dragged into it on the senate floor. >> it's not one of my favorite teams, but it's really, really fun to watch, and that's the new york jets. coach ryan, he's got a problem. he has three quarterbacks, sanchez, he's got tim tebow, he's got another guy. he can't decide who their quarterback is going to be. that's the same problem republicans are having. romney's gone, but he's still in the background. we have mcconnell and we have boehner. who is the quarterback, mr. president? who is the quarterback? >> there's some confusion about who the qua
cliff talks is the debt ceiling, with the government on pace to reach its borrowing limit early next year. the white house stated its position on the 14th amendment, which some theory rise is a way for the president to raise the debt limit independently, should republicans attempt to use it as a negotiating tool. >> i can say that this administration does not believe that the 14th amendment gives the president the power to ignore the debt ceiling, period. >> the fiscal cliff talks...
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it would be something like that. but remember, these guys hate the fiscal cliff. you know, it has caused this enormous problem. so the idea of setting up another fiscal cliff six months from now is pretty unappealing. but they'll have to go there. they just haven't quite figured out how to go there yet. >> harold, jump in. to an extent you'd feel the republicans are cornered on their position a bit, especially with this 2% in terms of raising tax rates? how do they get around this and argue back? i don't see it. >> well, i think early on, if you think about a year ago, a little over a year ago, the republicans had a better deal than what's put on the table now. they had a 3 1/2 ratio of spending cuts to tax increases. you're looking at best a 2-1, pure politics. so they've lost that part of the argument. you flip it over and i think these numbers that we're seeing this morning that we've all commented on -- and i happen to agree with steve and david's analysis that at the end of the day, we'll just extend the cuts for middle-class earners and raise it on the top e
it would be something like that. but remember, these guys hate the fiscal cliff. you know, it has caused this enormous problem. so the idea of setting up another fiscal cliff six months from now is pretty unappealing. but they'll have to go there. they just haven't quite figured out how to go there yet. >> harold, jump in. to an extent you'd feel the republicans are cornered on their position a bit, especially with this 2% in terms of raising tax rates? how do they get around this and...
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now we're talking about using the fiscal cliff or the debt ceiling as the ultimate weapon, trying to get something from the president now or give something to the president now with a threat that the debt ceiling will be used as the weapon in a few weeks or months. and quite frankly, that's no way to run a country. we need to move beyond this stalemate and this gridlock and both parties need to come together. i think the president's trying his best and, quite frankly, i would say that speaker boehner is really trying here. but these are difficult circumstances and i believe -- i return to what i said earlier. we had an election. the president won. when it comes to these tax matters, the people of this country are supportive of the president's approach. >> i'm curious, chip, and you were on this teleconference and obviously those are people very involved and very interested but there's an awful lot of fatigue, election fatigue in this country and, frankly, the holidays -- holiday season is upon us, people are busy, kids are back in school, so son and so forth. how much is public press
now we're talking about using the fiscal cliff or the debt ceiling as the ultimate weapon, trying to get something from the president now or give something to the president now with a threat that the debt ceiling will be used as the weapon in a few weeks or months. and quite frankly, that's no way to run a country. we need to move beyond this stalemate and this gridlock and both parties need to come together. i think the president's trying his best and, quite frankly, i would say that speaker...
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immigration and tax reform post the fiscal cliff will create a legacy and may see congress doing something. >> that is why it is so important that they figure out a way to come together before the end of the year hopefully. if the environment is poisoned like it was after the stimulus, after the health care debate, the next four years will be ugh low. >> that's true. the higher number of women increases the chances. we will see. >> i saw the women here smiling. we were talking about how collaborative they were. the guys, not so much. >> we don't smile. i agree. the more women the better. i'm agreeing with you. can i say nothing? i said the more women, the better. i'm agreeing with you. the more women, the less self destructive egos and getting to a deal. do you have a problem with that. >> no,i don't. >> go with it. i give up. >> all right. still ahead, hollywood mogul joins us on set and author sebastian younger will be here. more morning joe in a moment. ♪ for over 40 years, we've brought our passion for fine coffee and espresso to people everywhere. but one place was impossible, until
immigration and tax reform post the fiscal cliff will create a legacy and may see congress doing something. >> that is why it is so important that they figure out a way to come together before the end of the year hopefully. if the environment is poisoned like it was after the stimulus, after the health care debate, the next four years will be ugh low. >> that's true. the higher number of women increases the chances. we will see. >> i saw the women here smiling. we were talking...
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. >> yeah, but there's stimulus the white house wants as a result of the fiscal cliff deal. they don't want to see a lapse, for instance, in the payroll tax cut. although they'd be fine with it being replaced by something else. unemployment insurance passed, infrastructure spending, those are incentives for the white house to cut a deal on the fiscal cliff as opposed to just going over it and saying, okay, we'll just take the, you know, sequester cuts and bush tax rates. >> that's right, and they were willing to do that in 2010 and were criticized, of course, by the base of the party because they felt so strongly about the stimulus measures. that shows how firmly the president is going to fight for those in the final package. >> i think there's so many reasons why boehner has to take a deal, though, in addition. if you look at the polls, 2 to 1, the public blames the republicans if there is no deal. and he's, meanwhile, gotten his tea party radicals, he's punished them for not following his line and his leadership. so, you know, look at wall street, they so far the market's
. >> yeah, but there's stimulus the white house wants as a result of the fiscal cliff deal. they don't want to see a lapse, for instance, in the payroll tax cut. although they'd be fine with it being replaced by something else. unemployment insurance passed, infrastructure spending, those are incentives for the white house to cut a deal on the fiscal cliff as opposed to just going over it and saying, okay, we'll just take the, you know, sequester cuts and bush tax rates. >> that's...
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cliff. >> i know, the way he said that was unnerving. let me tell you something. >> it's also just that egotism that everybody reacts to. >> i was in china for ten days and with a group of mayors, the mayor of philadelphia, beijing, mayor nutter. and you know, people in china are asking about the fiscal cliff. everywhere we went. what's going on with you people? so the world is watching. and it's not just us. and i don't care, maybe you think the chinese, well, too bad for them, but it's not just the chinese, it's europe, and they're blaming the fact that their economies aren't going based on the fact that we're in this stalemate. you know, it's huge. >> harold, i mean, it all comes down to leadership. you know, when you talk to business owners, they want leadership shown. i'm glad the president is talking to business leaders now. >> and a debater on the phone. >> not only the administration but also on the other side of pennsylvania avenue with the republicans and harry reid in the senate. you're just not seeing it. >> you don't see eno
cliff. >> i know, the way he said that was unnerving. let me tell you something. >> it's also just that egotism that everybody reacts to. >> i was in china for ten days and with a group of mayors, the mayor of philadelphia, beijing, mayor nutter. and you know, people in china are asking about the fiscal cliff. everywhere we went. what's going on with you people? so the world is watching. and it's not just us. and i don't care, maybe you think the chinese, well, too bad for...
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it's an issue in this fiscal cliff fight. particularly if we go over the cliff and it turns into a pr battle. it's a problem longer-term, 2014, 2016. the party has to find a way to remake what people think of it and they're not there yet. >> and when you look, mark, at the optimism, pessimism, you find that people who are evenly divided, 48-48, as to whether there will be an agreement, they really want an agreement, though? >> this is a pessimistic are but a realistic public right now, and it's the public that watched what happened in 2011 during the debt ceiling standoff there. it was really interesting. we actually asked the question in december of 2008 after barack obama won his first presidential contest, and at that time 52% actually said we think the next congress is going to be an era of unity and willingness to compromise in congress. now when we ask that xwe, the newest poll, 69% actually are predicting disunity, division, and so this is a much more realistic public right now that is seeing everything that's going on
it's an issue in this fiscal cliff fight. particularly if we go over the cliff and it turns into a pr battle. it's a problem longer-term, 2014, 2016. the party has to find a way to remake what people think of it and they're not there yet. >> and when you look, mark, at the optimism, pessimism, you find that people who are evenly divided, 48-48, as to whether there will be an agreement, they really want an agreement, though? >> this is a pessimistic are but a realistic public right...
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cliff. it's not for michigan only. we see plants closing and jobs leaving and workers busted. the kind of deterioration coming in. workers must strike back in measure. a major one-day workers strike and marshall washington for jobs and justice. too much poverty. too many unemployed people. each of us must fight. workers deserve to be at the bargaining table. >> bob king, what will be the immediate affect on the uaw? >> you know, i'm not worried about the immediate effect on the uaw. i'm worried about the impact on society. this has to be seen as part of a right wing agenda. this lame-duck they're not just attacking labor, but limits. they're attacking teachers and schools. they're attacking everything that is good for working families. this right-wing agenda has to be staffed. labor, civil rights, faith community, lgbt, environmentalists, all of us got to come together and stand up for an america that has prosperity for everybody. not just for ceos and the greedy few at the top. >> this is a
cliff. it's not for michigan only. we see plants closing and jobs leaving and workers busted. the kind of deterioration coming in. workers must strike back in measure. a major one-day workers strike and marshall washington for jobs and justice. too much poverty. too many unemployed people. each of us must fight. workers deserve to be at the bargaining table. >> bob king, what will be the immediate affect on the uaw? >> you know, i'm not worried about the immediate effect on the uaw....
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it comes around the issue of the fiscal cliff talks about what the party wants to be. whether there's going to be a tea party 2 or whether there's something of a vacuum that doesn't get filled with demint leaving the senate. >> all right. david, thank you so much. we'll be watching "meet the press" this sunday as we do every sunday. eugene, thank you as well. your latest column online at washingtonpost.com. >> guard that mustache, gene. >> i'm going to guard it with my life. >> and congressman emanuel cleaver, great to have you on set with us. >>> coming up, nbc chief white house correspondent chuck todd. and later in the show, "the economist" crunched the numbers and came up with the best countries to be born in in 2013. and the united states does not top their list. we'll find out who does ahead on "morning joe." [ male announcer ] there are plenty of reasons to be jolly at the chevy year-end event because chevy's giving more. more efficiency with sonic and cruze... more function in equinox and traverse... more dependability with the legendary silverado... and more s
it comes around the issue of the fiscal cliff talks about what the party wants to be. whether there's going to be a tea party 2 or whether there's something of a vacuum that doesn't get filled with demint leaving the senate. >> all right. david, thank you so much. we'll be watching "meet the press" this sunday as we do every sunday. eugene, thank you as well. your latest column online at washingtonpost.com. >> guard that mustache, gene. >> i'm going to guard it with...
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are you hearing that social security might be something that's also included in the fiscal cliff deal? >> well, i'm hearing the democrats want to block that. they don't want the social security part of the deal. but the republicans are kind of insisting on it. that puts the white house in kind of a difficult position. that's one of the many issues holding up this deal right now. >> the political leverage in all of this, of course, some head pulling, indicating republicans would bear most of the blame if we go over the so-called cliff. last week's survey found that 21% of americans would blame president obama and the democrats. 23% say they would blame the republicans. 52% would be annoyed with both parties equally. is it really clear at this point who would be blamed? >> i think the -- >> i'm sorry. excuse me. >> it's okay. i think members of congress bear the brunt of this, especially the house. they're going to be the odd man out. i think in the end voters, if the deal does not happen, the house will carry a lot of blame for it. >> two member numbers very imp 39.6%, 35%. the preside
are you hearing that social security might be something that's also included in the fiscal cliff deal? >> well, i'm hearing the democrats want to block that. they don't want the social security part of the deal. but the republicans are kind of insisting on it. that puts the white house in kind of a difficult position. that's one of the many issues holding up this deal right now. >> the political leverage in all of this, of course, some head pulling, indicating republicans would bear...